Counter this

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Falcon59
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Counter this

Unread post by Falcon59 » Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:59 pm

I really like the "Counter this" thread on ForuMINI, so lets start one up here as well:
See also: Counter this on ForuMINI

The ideas is that you can put up ideas for builds and then have people come up with how they would counter the build and/or help tweak the build, so you can get an idea of the worst case scenario.
You should put in the setting of your game (points, restrictions and so on), and you can give hints to your general plan or tactics that you'd like to test.

I'll go first :slinger;
We normally play on two maps with 100 pts with single nation bonuses, no year restrictions.
1 SS Haupsturmführer 7
1 Focke-Wulf Fw 190A 14 (Air defense)
1 Jagdpanzer IV/70 (V) 25 (Played defensively)
2 SS Stormtroopers 7
1 Fallschirmjäger 8 (Either support hunter or take key terrain)
2 SS Panzergrenadier 7
1 Grizzled Veteran 8 (Either spawn with Fallschirmjäger or with unit in defense of objective)
1 MG 42 Machine Gun Team 10

Counter this! :mua:

thepanzerguy
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by thepanzerguy » Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:40 am

Here I go.
SS Haupstrumfuhrer-7
3 MG 42 teams-30 ( to counter all your infantry)
88 gun with shield ( antiar and AV attacks to take on your TD-20 points
2 SS panzer grenadiers- 14
1wehrmacht vet infantry-5
1vet fallschirmjager-10
1 panzer 3 Ausf F-13 ( Simply to have armored presence)
Built within the limitations of my collection. Counter my counter.

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RichtervonManthofen
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by RichtervonManthofen » Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:00 pm

2x Bofors L60 (2x9=18) - looky theres a German plane - and if he flies away we blast his infantry)
2x M1 81mm Mortar - great distance weapon agains 5/5 Infantry (2x12=24)
SE Captain +3 Init (11)
3x SE Paras (3x9=27) You bring one - I get three
5x M1 Garand (5x4=20) - you know you need grunts to do the work

We don't need no heroes - we ALL ARE HEROES

Place the Bofors so they have LOS to objective and cover much terrain, preferably in cover and making use of enhanced range if possible

Keep Mortars in cover - no need for LOS on those - we have mobile spotters - make use of Enhanced Range

Deploy Paras where they can spot for the mortars - play defensively (consider to hold your commander undeployed +3 init counts - deploy him when you need the bonus he provides for Garands with Stars and stripes - or if you need someone near the objective)

The enemy army has 25points deadweight (5/5/4 tank won't hurt our infantry - we have no vehicle)

carrion
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by carrion » Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:33 pm

RichtervonManthofen wrote:2x Bofors L60 (2x9=18) - looky theres a German plane - and if he flies away we blast his infantry)
2x M1 81mm Mortar - great distance weapon agains 5/5 Infantry (2x12=24)
SE Captain +3 Init (11)
3x SE Paras (3x9=27) You bring one - I get three
5x M1 Garand (5x4=20) - you know you need grunts to do the work

We don't need no heroes - we ALL ARE HEROES

Place the Bofors so they have LOS to objective and cover much terrain, preferably in cover and making use of enhanced range if possible

Keep Mortars in cover - no need for LOS on those - we have mobile spotters - make use of Enhanced Range

Deploy Paras where they can spot for the mortars - play defensively (consider to hold your commander undeployed +3 init counts - deploy him when you need the bonus he provides for Garands with Stars and stripes - or if you need someone near the objective)

The enemy army has 25points deadweight (5/5/4 tank won't hurt our infantry - we have no vehicle)
Not bad but you have 4 paras and I thought with the new build restrictions only 2 are allowed, plus only the the SE Command can spot with a range of 4 hexes.

Falcon59
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by Falcon59 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:41 pm

thepanzerguy wrote:Here I go.
SS Haupstrumfuhrer-7
3 MG 42 teams-30 ( to counter all your infantry)
88 gun with shield ( antiar and AV attacks to take on your TD-20 points
2 SS panzer grenadiers- 14
1wehrmacht vet infantry-5
1vet fallschirmjager-10
1 panzer 3 Ausf F-13 ( Simply to have armored presence)
Built within the limitations of my collection. Counter my counter.
Nice build, but I was hoping for an allied build.
Don't think I'd bring the 88 mm or the panzer - the 88 is powerfull, but easy to avoid and the panzer won't stand a chance against the TD ;-)

RichtervonManthofen wrote:2x Bofors L60 (2x9=18) - looky theres a German plane - and if he flies away we blast his infantry)
2x M1 81mm Mortar - great distance weapon agains 5/5 Infantry (2x12=24)
SE Captain +3 Init (11)
3x SE Paras (3x9=27) You bring one - I get three
5x M1 Garand (5x4=20) - you know you need grunts to do the work

We don't need no heroes - we ALL ARE HEROES

Place the Bofors so they have LOS to objective and cover much terrain, preferably in cover and making use of enhanced range if possible

Keep Mortars in cover - no need for LOS on those - we have mobile spotters - make use of Enhanced Range

Deploy Paras where they can spot for the mortars - play defensively (consider to hold your commander undeployed +3 init counts - deploy him when you need the bonus he provides for Garands with Stars and stripes - or if you need someone near the objective)

The enemy army has 25points deadweight (5/5/4 tank won't hurt our infantry - we have no vehicle)
Great build, but take out the SE Captain and the mortars have no spotter and need LoS.
I like the Bofors' and paras, but I think that my Stormtroopers combined with the SS Commander (expert will) will have the edge.
Good point on the 25pts deadweight :party:

Falcon59
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by Falcon59 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:48 pm

carrion wrote:Not bad but you have 4 paras and I thought with the new build restrictions only 2 are allowed, plus only the the SE Command can spot with a range of 4 hexes.
We normally play by the errata of 09/10/2010 and this is the newest I could find, that only puts a restriction on heroes (one pr. army pr. 100 pts)

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RichtervonManthofen
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by RichtervonManthofen » Mon Jan 28, 2013 5:12 pm

carrion wrote:
RichtervonManthofen wrote:2x Bofors L60 (2x9=18) - looky theres a German plane - and if he flies away we blast his infantry)
2x M1 81mm Mortar - great distance weapon agains 5/5 Infantry (2x12=24)
SE Captain +3 Init (11)
3x SE Paras (3x9=27) You bring one - I get three
5x M1 Garand (5x4=20) - you know you need grunts to do the work

We don't need no heroes - we ALL ARE HEROES

Place the Bofors so they have LOS to objective and cover much terrain, preferably in cover and making use of enhanced range if possible

Keep Mortars in cover - no need for LOS on those - we have mobile spotters - make use of Enhanced Range

Deploy Paras where they can spot for the mortars - play defensively (consider to hold your commander undeployed +3 init counts - deploy him when you need the bonus he provides for Garands with Stars and stripes - or if you need someone near the objective)

The enemy army has 25points deadweight (5/5/4 tank won't hurt our infantry - we have no vehicle)
Not bad but you have 4 paras and I thought with the new build restrictions only 2 are allowed, plus only the the SE Command can spot with a range of 4 hexes.
Honestly those unofficial rules tweaks are ignored here.

I even do not use those Enhanced rules.

I play it by the "advanced rulebook"

Panzer Commander
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by Panzer Commander » Mon Jan 28, 2013 5:25 pm

RichtervonManthofen wrote:
carrion wrote:
RichtervonManthofen wrote:2x Bofors L60 (2x9=18) - looky theres a German plane - and if he flies away we blast his infantry)
2x M1 81mm Mortar - great distance weapon agains 5/5 Infantry (2x12=24)
SE Captain +3 Init (11)
3x SE Paras (3x9=27) You bring one - I get three
5x M1 Garand (5x4=20) - you know you need grunts to do the work

We don't need no heroes - we ALL ARE HEROES

Place the Bofors so they have LOS to objective and cover much terrain, preferably in cover and making use of enhanced range if possible

Keep Mortars in cover - no need for LOS on those - we have mobile spotters - make use of Enhanced Range

Deploy Paras where they can spot for the mortars - play defensively (consider to hold your commander undeployed +3 init counts - deploy him when you need the bonus he provides for Garands with Stars and stripes - or if you need someone near the objective)

The enemy army has 25points deadweight (5/5/4 tank won't hurt our infantry - we have no vehicle)
Not bad but you have 4 paras and I thought with the new build restrictions only 2 are allowed, plus only the the SE Command can spot with a range of 4 hexes.
Honestly those unofficial rules tweaks are ignored here.

I even do not use those Enhanced rules.

I play it by the "advanced rulebook"
Well, even with all that said, are you also ignoring the revised cards? Because that's where "Improved Indirect Fire" was nerfed to allow only commanders to be the only non-spotter troops who can spot for the mortars, and then only at range 4 or less. To play the original card where any US troop can spot for the mortars is clown shoes IMO.

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Centurion
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by Centurion » Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:25 pm

This sounds like a "I could beat that army thread."

I'll have one up in few minutes once I get the hang of it.
A piece of spaghetti or a military unit can only be led from the front end. George S. Patton

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A.K.A.: Centurion24

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RichtervonManthofen
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Re: Counter this

Unread post by RichtervonManthofen » Mon Jan 28, 2013 10:28 pm

Panzer Commander wrote:
RichtervonManthofen wrote:
carrion wrote:
RichtervonManthofen wrote:2x Bofors L60 (2x9=18) - looky theres a German plane - and if he flies away we blast his infantry)
2x M1 81mm Mortar - great distance weapon agains 5/5 Infantry (2x12=24)
SE Captain +3 Init (11)
3x SE Paras (3x9=27) You bring one - I get three
5x M1 Garand (5x4=20) - you know you need grunts to do the work

We don't need no heroes - we ALL ARE HEROES

Place the Bofors so they have LOS to objective and cover much terrain, preferably in cover and making use of enhanced range if possible

Keep Mortars in cover - no need for LOS on those - we have mobile spotters - make use of Enhanced Range

Deploy Paras where they can spot for the mortars - play defensively (consider to hold your commander undeployed +3 init counts - deploy him when you need the bonus he provides for Garands with Stars and stripes - or if you need someone near the objective)

The enemy army has 25points deadweight (5/5/4 tank won't hurt our infantry - we have no vehicle)
Not bad but you have 4 paras and I thought with the new build restrictions only 2 are allowed, plus only the the SE Command can spot with a range of 4 hexes.
Honestly those unofficial rules tweaks are ignored here.

I even do not use those Enhanced rules.

I play it by the "advanced rulebook"
Well, even with all that said, are you also ignoring the revised cards? Because that's where "Improved Indirect Fire" was nerfed to allow only commanders to be the only non-spotter troops who can spot for the mortars, and then only at range 4 or less. To play the original card where any US troop can spot for the mortars is clown shoes IMO.
Well that is your opinion...

The other side is that you can either play by the rules or by the house rules...

You can buy the game and read the rulebooks and the cards

Then you can read the wizards homepage

But as long as not all potential opponents have equal acess to those online-assets you have to agree on a basic common rule - and thats the printed rulebook and the cards - as those you can take with you ad show all your opponents.

All other rules and revisons are simply new rules - even those revised cards (revised means not original - and one can simply say he will play only original and not revised)

Yeah that even means that you can play the SS-PG and Ranger at 5 points

But of course I agree that other like to play the game differently... :D

BTW - then simply drop out the 3 SE Paras and add 4 Rangers (and change a M1 to a 3 inch) and I get one more soldier and have the same firepower ;)

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